Transcript
Bryan McCartney
You’re listening to Ushering Death, follow us on all good podcast apps or at usheringdeath.com.au. Today I’m joined by Yarni Dorge who has come with us today to share her own experiences with grief and loss and what that looks like as a parent who loses a child. Yarni, tell us a bit about you and summer.
Yarni Dorge
I don’t know where to start. Perhaps from the beginning Yeah,
Bryan McCartney
beginnings always.
Yarni Dorge
We I desperately wanted to go. And when we found out we were having summer, it was elation. All the grandparents were happy come from a lot of grandsons. So we had granddaughter so yeah, she was the first of the list and had a fairly normal pregnancy. Then I,
Bryan McCartney
you were living in Sydney at this time your husband was in the military in the army. And so you had your son Xavier, living in Sydney. So those support network families all in Brisbane friends are all in Brisbane assist you, Tony husband.
Yarni Dorge
So um, yeah, went down to yep to sedate. I knew no one. I then throughout it could not feel a lot of movement. Her placenta was at the front of my belly.
Bryan McCartney
Was that for the whole pregnancy? Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
Yarni Dorge
So she.
Bryan McCartney
So you’re living in Sydney, it’s yourself, your husband and son and you’re pregnant with summer? And you’re saying that her placenta was at the front? So limited movement? You could feel three pregnancy? That’s right. Normal thing or?
Yarni Dorge
Yeah. So you can have a posterior and anterior depending on where the placenta sits? It can be anywhere really it? Yeah, so mine was more at the front. And so I felt a lot sort of through my back and my spine. But once she’d gotten bigger, I could feel a little bit more. But it was a pretty stressful event. Had some people visiting, hadn’t really thought too much about the the movements and and all of that. So then I was in a mother’s group that has been my absolute support and rock. And they were helpful with my question to them of hey, I can’t feel anything. You know, what, what would you suggest to sort of help movement. And it got to a point where there was nothing that I was doing that was helping.
Bryan McCartney
So things like ice cold water, or
Yarni Dorge
some lemonade, get some sugar into your into the baby and get them to kick around a bit. And yeah, moving positions and all that kind of stuff. Nothing was working. I called the hospital. And they suggested that I come down. Tony was away at them at the time, as most military wives will know that once they’re away, everything goes wrong. But we had no idea how wrong that was going to be. So I packed Xavier into the car with some toys and iPads and Alas, went to the hospital to try and find a heartbeat. And they weren’t able to find one.
Bryan McCartney
How old was exactly at that time?
Yarni Dorge
He would have been one and a half, almost two. So he
Bryan McCartney
Yeah. bundled into the car off to the hospital with a nearly two year old. Yeah. Then they tell you they can’t find a heartbeat.
Yarni Dorge
That’s right. He’s bouncing off the walls and I’m numb. Then I thought I don’t know how to get contact with Tony. So I’ve I’ve tried to message him. I’ve tried to call. I didn’t have a definitive answer of someone. I did speak to him. He’s like, look, it’s bedtime. Basically. I’ll keep my phone on and we’ll go from there.
Bryan McCartney
How far through pregnancy were you at this
Yarni Dorge
stage? That is six weeks. Okay. So it was just around the corner. So, yeah. Then when I tried to bring him back, he’d obviously had his phone on silent. So he didn’t hear me. So then it was a real mad scramble to how do I deal with this? The nurses then saying, Xavier can’t stay here. You’ve got to have him. Take him. Like he can’t be in the birthing suite. We’re going to move you into the birthing suite. There was nothing he could do. I said I don’t know anyone here I don’t. Oh, what about a neighbour? I don’t remember. Maybe its neighbours. Family friend. I don’t have anyone. You mum. I don’t have anyone. So it was very odd for them to sort of come across a situation where there was no one else to take a child. So they admitted Xavier and with me And we shared a bed. And yeah, I was always very grateful for their compassion. And they weren’t a hospital that was normally set up for that sort of situation. But they tried to cater as best they could for me. So yeah, finally got on to Tony. He was able to then fly up first thing the next morning. Both my parents came up the next morning as well. Or down rather from Brisbane to Sydney. Yeah, and then we had to process what was happening. They then gave me some medication to take to then start the process of labour. So then I had to go home. And I think probably the hardest part of that all of that was unpacking, yeah, my hospital bag, to then put things in that I’m going to need for me without the possibility of a baby. So I didn’t need any of the nappies. I didn’t need any of the bits and pieces that you would normally have in a bag to go to the hospital with,
Bryan McCartney
because I guess it 36 weeks is sort of prepared and you planned and you’ve got that already. Right. So had you taken that with you to the hospital?
Yarni Dorge
And not originally No. My first initial expectation was, we’re just going to find a heartbeat, I’ll be sent home. Something similar had happened with Xavier. And that was sort of ridiculed by one of the midwives that now you’re just going to have to sit here for an hour while we get some tracing. So I was in the headspace of I don’t want to interrupt anyone, this is probably nothing. Yeah, I didn’t realise how important counting your kicks was. Especially when they get bigger. It’s often a myth that they stopped moving as much as Xavier nearly broke my ribs on several occasions, which is way for exactly. Whereas with summer, it was a different experience. So yeah, when I was pregnant with my second daughter, I was a lot more vigilant.
Bryan McCartney
So the hospital gives you this medication, they send you home, and that starts the process of labour and then obviously have to go back to the hospital and go through the process of of giving birth. How has that feel as a mother knowing that that’s, that’s what’s happening for you?
Yarni Dorge
It’s undescribable. Yeah, it’s probably one of I didn’t really break down until I was unpacking that bag. So my mum was there. And it was just this guttural release. So I guess I did a lot of my release, before I got there. But knowing that you’re going into a process where you’ve been in that situation before, and you’ve been rewarded with a child, and you’re now about to go in, and although you will have a child, you won’t hear that first screen. And you won’t hear that, you know, suckling to the breast and all the things that you’re supposed to be nurturing and loving and having that. Yep, yeah.
Bryan McCartney
That just must be devastating. Yeah,
Yarni Dorge
devastating is a good word. A lot of other swear words.
Bryan McCartney
I can imagine. I guess, you know, I know both of your parents, and I know your family pretty well. And you have an incredible family unit. And I can imagine that that support at the time was definitely helpful, but challenging at the same time,
Yarni Dorge
it was dad was in charge of a bustling two year old while he was trying to deal with and process what was happening. Mom was in the birthing suite with me. And was an incredible support as well. Everything that could go wrong, did go wrong in the birthing suite. And I’m thankful that I had my fiery mother to yell at the anaesthetist anyway, where are you supposed to take this long, etc, etc. They promised me all the drugs I had nothing. Yeah, so was therapeutic in a way that you didn’t have. You could feel things so you could scream and you know, push through all that pain physically as well as mentally but it was quite a quite an experience laying there while you’re in the in a live acting birthing suite with other babies down the corridor being born. When the nurse comes in to check on you, you’ve got that little door that swings open and shut. You can hear little babies, screaming and crying and there was one lady, excuse me, who had just given birth, not long after they’ve given me everything to start the process. And I think I made a comment. She said, Oh, yeah, a baby was just born. And it sort of, then hit me that that’s not what I’m going to hear. This is not my, this is not for me. I’m not going to experience that. And I think to going in, you know, my dad had a bit of a pull me aside, are you going to be okay? Do you know that this is not going to happen for you? Do you know that you’re not going to come home? Like, I think because I was so numb, I just kind of forgot to show emotion. So I think everyone was a little bit worried about how it couldn’t cope and how I was going to deal with that and how it was going to play out. Yeah. Are you do you know that? You know, X, Y, and Zed some of the nurses said to me, in our experience, this is what a child can come out looking like. You’ve got to prepare yourself for that situation. So I sort of went in. Terrified. Yeah. Worst case scenario. Exactly. She’s gonna come out completely blue or purple, black, you know, disfigured or dis morphed. And she didn’t. She didn’t. Yeah, she looked like an exact,
Bryan McCartney
perfect little baby girl. Exactly. Yeah,
Yarni Dorge
exactly. Little. Had she ever had had her eyes open. She would have Yeah. Yeah, everything was
Bryan McCartney
normal. Yeah. And then, obviously, after the birth, so you and Tony, your husband had some time this summer?
Yarni Dorge
Yeah, that’s right. There was an issue. So she did pass away because she was wrapped in her cord. So there was a little bit of actually, when I was trying to birth, they were worried that she wasn’t actually going to exit properly. Because the cord was so tightly wrapped around her. So yeah, there was a process of trying to figure out how she died if she looked so perfect. And she was supposed to make it. Yeah. So yeah, there was that process of such a simple mishap, I guess. So yeah, we did. We had some time. With her in the hospital room. One of my beautiful friends had organised heartfelt photography, recovery, non for profit, they go out to hospitals, and they take photos for people that have had either stillbirths or children death in a hospital. And the lovely lady that we had was just, she was amazing. So I was very, very lucky to have fi our photographer. She just bought this calming presence into the room. And it really did help. She had had a similar experience to us. And she said that, you know, she whispered a few things to summer and you know, about her daughter and showed us her experience, which was also really helpful as well.
Bryan McCartney
What did the next sort of few weeks look like for you?
Yarni Dorge
I don’t remember. I think a lot of the stuff was sort of blocked out. I went to a very dark place. Yeah, it was. It was difficult for me to I guess, process, the fact that my body had potentially failed my child, I had a lot of guilt, that she was the first granddaughter in a long line of boys and sort of often mentioned that she was never you’ll always have boys. You’ve married into a boy family. You’ve got boy cousins, that sort of thing. Yeah. Yeah, it was sort of that, that loss of wanting a girl. My my body not giving me what we bargained for. Yeah, it was. It was tough.
Bryan McCartney
How do you process that feeling of guilt? I still
Yarni Dorge
carry it sometimes. But I guess the difference is that I visited now, and I kind of just let it go. Yeah, it is what it is. It the process is difficult. Yeah. Yeah, I went to a very dark place. And if it hadn’t been for Tony, recognising the signs to get me help. It could have been a very different situation.
Bryan McCartney
And what did that help look like for you?
Yarni Dorge
We were able to access because of the army. Some great psychologists. So professional help. Support Network again with the the mothers group online. They have been, you know, they raised some money, they were able to get me some things that I sort of cherished and looked at daily, used daily to make sure that I was staying on track for the right reasons. Yeah, it’s I’m just trying to remember. Yeah, a lot of a lot of support in different areas. People have had previous experience has come forward to help me sort of create a roadmap. Yeah, support from people that don’t have that situation, but they wanted to help. Professional help with psychologists every week. Many years,
Bryan McCartney
did you find that sort of lived experience? So people who’d shared that sort of same experience for you? Was that helpful?
Yarni Dorge
It was, yeah, absolutely. What did you do? What did you find that was helpful? I really like to have a plan. So when something that’s not planned will eventuate it’s definitely one of those things that it helps to have a mud map of life. And they mentioned several different things. So one thing that I gravitated towards was the urn pendant, which I’ve worn every single day. And also candles. Okay, so and
Bryan McCartney
then you obviously with the candles, you took that a little bit further as well. And we will talk a bit more about that. We’ll come back to it. But so after summer is born, and then you go through a funeral process and that sort of thing. And then life sort of starts to change in Sydney for you guys. Is that
Yarni Dorge
right? Yeah, that’s right. So it sort of brought home for Tony and I that we wanted to be closer to family. We needed that support network. But it was also important for me that if we were to have another child, that I could create that circle, yeah. And again, birth in Sydney. And we had a missed miscarriage. Not long after that. And then eventually we got Leila therapy. We did it eventually. But there was a lot of a lot of heartache.
Bryan McCartney
Yeah. Okay. So you still in Sydney at this stage? Before labour was available. One in Brisbane, one in Sydney in Sydney. Okay,
Yarni Dorge
three weeks before we posted. Yeah, wow, it was a tight, tight thing. But it was so important for me to have that experience to come full circle. I burst her in the same same hospital, which was very healing. Everything sort of came full circle. Yeah.
Bryan McCartney
So talk to us a bit about the what you did with with the candles, obviously, you know, we talk about rituals in depth in maintaining those bonds and connecting with those bonds after a person’s passing. So talk to us about the candles that you started.
Yarni Dorge
When summer passed, I wasn’t as prepared as I would have liked to have been. I had a backpack but I hadn’t sort of got her going home outfit, I guess you could say. So for me, that was always a regret that I wasn’t prepared enough. So what I was trying to find was a personalised candle. And a lot of the candles that I were looking at looking at sorry, we’re not sort of what I was after. So because Xavier was only one and a half, he was still very creative, I guess you could say with his paint skills. So I wanted to incorporate him in some way. So I did a lot of research as best as I could to create candles that I wanted, that I felt that she deserved. In place of her going home outfit, if I can’t do that, let’s send you out with something at least. So I got him ever to paint a candle nonflammable paints, sealed it, all of that. And that stood proudly. I had her coffin, when we when when she was first born term going off on a bit of a tangent. When she was first born, we had a Padre come in. And he, you know, helped us heal. With that. The hospital again was very lovely. They turned off all the fire extinguishers and all the fire alarms in our little section just for an hour, and He lit a candle and we had some nice words. So her candle became a pillar for me because that was 10am she was born or just a little bit before so 10am Every day I let that candle Yeah. And that was something that was connected to that situation to her. That was my ritual. And so therefore that’s been brought on this candle is only really small I want to continue burning that. So then at the funeral before everyone came in, we transferred that flame so we lit her candle, transferred that flame over to the new candles and now we’ve got that candle safely kept away so Yeah, that was really important. So Xavier had his little I’m doing this with my, with my
Bryan McCartney
painted candle. Yeah,
Yarni Dorge
it’s a little contribution to your sister. You know, we had a viewing he gave her a kiss and a cuddle. Yeah, it was all very. Yeah, healing, I guess is a word that I keep coming back to. So that was, that was important for me her candle, because then I had three candles. One was a really, really big one had something like 95 hours of burning time. So every day at 10am for an hour, I’d light a candle. I still, to this day, think he’s nine this year. I have an alarm on my phone for 10am Because I was terrified. I was gonna miss that time. So yeah, I still have an alarm goes off my way.
Bryan McCartney
Does that still bring you comfort in those things as well, because I
Yarni Dorge
can’t light a candle every single day. I got to a panic mode where it was I’m going to leave the house I have an appointment to go to I’m going to be out of the house. I can’t let my candle. So I was at least I could say good morning, my kids every morning when they see it. Wanting summer. Yeah, we turn the alarm off. Obviously, when I’m working in has to go on silence. I don’t have it out in my bag. But yeah, it’s still there. Yeah, every single day regardless now, whether I can turn it off on. It’s still there. Yeah, the candle thing has been a comfort because it was something physical that I could do without having anything that I could do to control this situation. So I’m in control about lighting a candle. So that was comfort for me.
Bryan McCartney
Yeah. And then not only did you do that for yourself, but then you sort of started doing that for other people. Yeah, same situation. Yeah,
Yarni Dorge
exactly. So started off that I wanted to just donate candles. And financially, it just wasn’t feasible. So I created a business around that. If you were to purchase a candle, one would be donated as part of that price. And it would go to other children in simulus other families rather who have stillbirth children. So I would then donate that to the same hospital just in the beginning. Yeah, so I’ve sort of kept that tradition alive with donating, but it has slowed down a little bit now. But yeah, each birthday. I do try and do something. Yeah.
Bryan McCartney
So you’ve got Xavier, you’ve got les with three weeks before you sort of ship out from Sydney. And you’ve been posted back to Brisbane at that stage. That’s right. Yes. So the grief doesn’t stop for you at that point. Obviously, grief never stops for us at all. But I guess probably more specifically, the tragedy doesn’t stop for you at that point. So it sort of took a bit of a turn for the worst for you when you were relocating back to Brisbane. Tell us a bit about that story.
Yarni Dorge
Was it Murphy’s Law? It can get worse it does damned if you’ve got time to fall. Yeah, did. So. I just started to see the bright side of life again, I was the pregnancy with Leila was very stressful. Every time that I couldn’t feel anything. I’m straight on to the phone to the hospital. So she just come along. And it was chaos. We had packers coming into our house to pack up. And we had a removalist team coming the day after. So it took maybe six or seven people to put everything of our life into boxes. And that was an all day thing. So again, Dad had come up to wrangle Mr. Zevia, who is just bouncing off walls as a normal now almost two year old. No, two and a half. So yeah, he was in charge of that. So there was the door open. It grew between Tony and I holding the baby feeding, sleeping, all that kind of stuff while the chaos was going around us.
Bryan McCartney
And because Tony was part of the the army, so they provide those sorts of things. So movers and people to pack and that sort of stuff. Every
Yarni Dorge
time you posted you get the privilege of meeting more people who get to touch your things and put them in boxes or privileges that other people wouldn’t.
Bryan McCartney
So you’ve got Packers and Movers in the house, you’ve got your dad down. You’ve got two kids under three
Yarni Dorge
dogs, cats, turtles fish, and then naturally
Bryan McCartney
have a family. Yeah.
Yarni Dorge
It’s um, yeah, so I had some listings. I wasn’t as prepared for this move as I’d like to have been. So there was a few things that I still had to do as part of the Packers wouldn’t touch your personal things. We had made sort of a shrine for summer. And it was on like a little buffet table against the front door or near the front door rather. And prior to that I’d had a an urn made for her in I think it was more By Kondo contacted some people out there and they were able to do a purple and brass so it looked like gold. And for her because I again, I was terrified that if the house burned down, we’d lose our ashes or if Xavier was playing with it or something, and it fell down. Yes. Like that famous movie. Yeah, so I was terrified. So I wanted something that was going to be strong, resilient. So we had her purple, brass burn. Yeah. Terrible. And her candles. There was another lady who one of my beautiful friends had organised to do a Summer’s name over in Western Australia, and then the sunsets and she takes photos of that as with the ocean. So a little plaque of that I’d got some little dolls and things. So with her shrine, we’re needing to be packed up basically. We had a bear again that the mothers group it organised for me with her name embroidered in the beds feet. Again, her silk flowers in a wreath that needed to be packed up as well. That was on her coffin. So yeah, all of her little trinkets, I guess that I had sort of collected and been donated by my support network. So I had asked for some boxes to be given to me, so I could do that. I then had to go to a hotel to stay that night, Tony stayed at the house with the dogs. And then the next morning, we had the removalist. I was exhausted, I don’t think I left the house until about midnight. Until the baby and the small child and the father into the car to go to the hotel didn’t think of anything about checking where the boxes were what what was happening to them. I had packed it, it was there it was ready to go. Last thought of my mind. The next morning, I called Tony to make sure that everything was going smoothly with the removal lists. And just made a mention just make sure they don’t put some as boxes into the car into the Make sure you put them into the car, don’t let them put them in the drop. And that’s when it started to realise or when we started to realise neither of us knew where that box was. Yeah, wow. We asked the Packers and which we didn’t find out until after this. It all happened that we could have stopped them and we could have made them unpack. But they had already packed half a container with our things. I was in hysterics Tony was panicking. The box was supposed to go in our car. Yeah, we didn’t know what that box was. Then it was okay. Let’s just keep going. They’re obviously not going to stop. They’ve got time constraints. Still left half of the house to pack. I was supposed to get onto a flight. So I go to the airport. I meet Tony Tony was driving once all I don’t have finished he was driving to Brisbane. And we would have got our things I think on the 12th of January. So it had to be coming to terms with no other choice. You’re just going to see her on the other side.
Bryan McCartney
So you make the decision. Everything else is going to us the boxes with other stuff.
Yarni Dorge
She’s gonna go on a road trip, she’ll be okay. It’ll be fine. Yeah, it was not fine. Not the case. No. We got our things. I think it got to about the 19th I had unpacked every single box and there was something like 300 boxes. Every single box was unpacked.
Bryan McCartney
Anyone that knows you That’s an incredible feat. I’m not a hoarder, to unpack all the VOCs within that short space of time. I’m in France
Yarni Dorge
look they weren’t completely put back into the box. I think we had a spare room that was like a mountain of just don’t go in there things will fall on you and you will die. But the boxes were unpacked and they were all accounted for. I got my dad to come over and go through the same boxes. We looked on the beds. We looked through cupboards box after box after box in the car. We knew that she had to be somewhere she wasn’t. So I think on the 19th of January we found ourselves having to call toll and we’re missing a box. The only box that is missing the only box that mattered the only box them at it. Yeah. She’s not here. How you
Bryan McCartney
feeling at that stage? panicked because not only have you lost some through birth, but then you lost her again in the mirror. frights again that trauma or resurfaces that feeling.
Yarni Dorge
So I was diagnosed with PTSD, high anxiety and depression. And my PTSD just went into skyrocket mode over the smallest things of I can’t function in my kitchen because the sink is around the wrong way. Yeah, well, Sydney my sink drainer was on the left now it’s on the right I can’t. That’s I can’t be in here. I look in my pantry. My pantry is now bigger than when I had I can’t be in here you know little things that just yeah, just sent me over the edge. I couldn’t
Bryan McCartney
the smallest things that never would have had an impact for you historically now. triggering your kitchen sink.
Yarni Dorge
Like, why is that a thing? Yeah, it was it was terrifying. To just not know, having the unknown is it’s terrifying. Yeah, yeah,
Bryan McCartney
we’re gonna take a short break but we’ll be right back so they love you sister is Australia’s hardest working cancer vanquishing charity, and since its inception in 2012 has raised over $14 million for medical research. Founded by gold lurgi winning actor and 2018 Victorian Australian of the Year Samuel Johnson. Love Your sister is a million strong village of everyday Aziz committed to vanquishing cancer with hard science and the best new technologies. Love your sister supports personalised treatment for all cancer patients. Whatever the cancer, regardless of location, income or status. They strive for the right treatment for every cancer patient first time every time. Lobbyists used to proudly pass on 100% of every donation received to scientific research and personalised treatment. No skimming no bullshit. You can help McCartney family funeral support love your sister by visiting McCartney funerals.com.au forward slash l y s. Love you sister. We’re back with Jani Dortch. Hi Jani. Hello. So we got to where you’ve arrived in Brisbane, you’ve unpacked all of your boxes. You’ve got your dad over, but there’s nothing summers box. And all of those things that keep you connected to her are gone, but haven’t arrived. So what happens next?
Yarni Dorge
A mad panic, mad scramble. I’m not sure if I can say the removal is company, but
Bryan McCartney
we might keep them
Yarni Dorge
to other issues that they’ve had things bought up on my behalf. So I’ll just let the natural progression. But yeah, they sent out a representative. They told sent out a representative for them as well. Basically, why haven’t you told us this has happened? Why is it been so long before you got to us? Again, we weren’t told that it was a thing that we had to worry about. And that it was we were trying to find her we were trying to do all the things that we were supposed to to try and find her before we panicked. And that panic station has now come to fruition. And now we’re panicking. Yeah. What are you going to do to help us?
Bryan McCartney
What did it feel like when you’re talking to them? Was it like they were trying to help? Or was it they were just trying to make sure that they weren’t to blame or both? Yeah,
Yarni Dorge
total has been amazing. They they’ve always been very helpful with with all of that removalist company at all ever. They just keep referring back to tall because they were subcontracted by tall. Right? But it was frustrating, upsetting knowing that there are many other defence communities posting at the moment, and it is bedlam. And then this has to happen. Then it’s a matter of has she been put into they originally told us that our container wasn’t shared. And through investigation, it was right. So then it was contacting that other family. Did you receive anything? No, we haven’t. We received things that didn’t belong to us. And apparently it was thrown out. So then we’re thinking, great. Has that been a box? Yeah, that was ours. That didn’t belong to the person that they’d unpacked. And they’ve just tossed it. Yeah. So then you
Bryan McCartney
would hope that someone who’d come across an urn and candles and that sort of stuff would understand. Yeah, in a common sense that they wouldn’t, wouldn’t do that.
Yarni Dorge
Exactly. I guess the thing was, if it didn’t belong to you, it’s too hard to figure out. Yeah. So let’s just candles. No one needs candles. I’ll get some more. Her urn didn’t look like an urn, a traditional urn, I guess. So our other concern was that someone had seen it while we were packing our things, decided it was a desirable object and taking it for themselves. Only to maybe find out later on that it wasn’t as it seemed. That was my hope. My hope is still she’s under someone else’s bed, in a box as a mistaken identity. I rang churches, I ran police stations, I rang anything that I could find that someone might drop it off. Yeah. You know, as a stolen item. I don’t want to have anything to do with this. This looks like it’s more than I should have. No one had any information. Yeah, I rang Sydney, I rang Brisbane Crime Stoppers, both, I’ve put in reports for both. And again, it just sits there until someone decides that they’re going to hand it in. I’ve contacted the funeral home that looked after us to let them know. I guess the the great part about her ashes were that she had a little piece of paper of all her details, the funeral director, all of their details. And it’s just a little piece of paper that just sat in amongst the ashes. We were told, you know, it’s not rubbish. It’s meant to be there. And I’m so grateful it was
Bryan McCartney
which and what you’re talking about there is called a cremation certificate. So that certificate is generally inside people’s ashes, when when you get them back. For people who don’t know that you’ll have a little piece of paper generally inside the ashes, along with the ashes. Yeah, and that’s right. That’s exactly for that purpose. It’s a second way to identify them.
Yarni Dorge
Yeah, so I’m hoping so we did rep. So I requested her ashes to come back in a plastic bag. Because the urn or the box that we got her in was not her final destination. I knew that this urn was coming from overseas, and that was her going to be her her home. So we got the st Padre to come back and bless the urn before we put her ashes in. So it was more of that ceremonial again, we burn the candles and the ritual. Exactly. And I’m big into symbolism. I love making everything tie together in a neat little bow, unlike my life. Yeah, so that was really important. So she was wrapped in her blanket that she was born. And then we wrapped a blanket around her. So we wrap that blanket was big enough to earn was big and it was an adult. So it’s big enough for us to wrap her ashes and then put her ashes into the urn. Yeah. So I’m hoping that if someone did open the lid, you would see her little blanket. Yeah, you couldn’t see the ashes. But I don’t know whether that’s gone against me in the fact that if someone did open it, they would have just sort of discarded it not realising perhaps what it is.
Bryan McCartney
And so when nine years nearly on Isn’t that right, and you still have never had the ashes returned or come back to
Yarni Dorge
you know, we had her for about a year. You know, home in our possession. I used to take her in my handbag. Yeah, I go to the shops and I would be terrified that my house would burn down. That panic that something would happen. Someone would break in and they would steal the urn, so I took her ashes in her little plastic bag, to the shops. I would bring her everywhere. family trips, all of that. She came with us in the car. She was not left behind. Yeah, and then this happens and now thankfully, again with my amazing mother’s group that I was in they raised some money for me so I was able to get ashes pendant so I have some of her ashes in a little pendant that’s it that’s all I have left. So I guess in some x aspects I do have her still the rest of her I have no idea
Bryan McCartney
through your entire experience and your your journey. What’s been the best piece of advice you’ve gotten?
Yarni Dorge
Great question. I’m not sure. I’ve had lots
Bryan McCartney
What about then what what advice would you give to someone in your situation of losing a baby through gestation
Yarni Dorge
don’t stay silent. I lost a lot of friends. Because they didn’t want to be sad around me. I bought that stigma of being the girl that lost the baby and then the girl that lost the baby and then lost her ashes. So there was that great. When I look at you, I associate you with this situation. Yeah. And over the years of creating candles for others I have consoled I have heard of. And I have helped a lot of people just with listening to their story that they trust me, I guess their story. But the biggest advice I could give is just to talk. They are your child. At the end of the day, you have living children, you will talk about them. You would celebrate all their things or their birthdays, all of their milestones, etc. There’s no difference. She’s still my child. She’s still my daughter. She was the first granddaughter. And I gave her middle name to Leila. Yeah. So again, it’s that little nod to her that we still have her in, in lots of other things, again, comes back to that symbolism and complete circle.
Bryan McCartney
I think it’s that idea again, of continuing bonds. So when a person dies, doesn’t mean that we stop, you know that they stop being that person to us all sorts of things. And the continuing bond is such an important part of the grieving process. How do you think you’ve grieved, do you think your grief is easier today than what it was? Nine years ago?
Yarni Dorge
Yes and no. So when I was pregnant with her, I associated where we were living, there was a lot of sulphur crested cockatoos because Xavier was so little it was some as birdies. And now that’s kind of just created throughout the years. So I was always very lucky, I would hang out watching and they would see me and screech and absolutely stopped my heart. So that was sort of always my you know, I’d then they would swing from one tree to another and then I’d have the cuckoo bars and then then start to laugh and I’m thinking nature’s against nature’s door to hear just ganging up on me. And this is hilarious to scare the crap person hanging out a washing. So yeah, that was that sort of connection to nature, I guess. And then when she paused so now when I see sulphur crested cockatoos, that’s summers berries. And then on the rare occasion that we’re very lucky to hear one of the Black Cockatoos, and that is just spine tingling. So we had a lot of again, symbolisms and nods towards her. So when I hear you know, Xavier red song, follow the sun, again, that summer song and we had that at her funeral. And, again, that song has some of the black coffee, black cockatoos in the in the background. So I guess my grief. It’s a nod. So it was a way for a wedding just recently, and we were staying out in the middle of Mulaney beautiful countryside, and it started to rain. And the sun was shining through and the rainbow stopped in our front yard. Yeah. Wow. So
Bryan McCartney
is there a pot of gold? Oh,
Yarni Dorge
it was me. I’m the end of there. But you know, there was self cockatoos and the rainbow and the rain. And I guess it’s just that surrealism of, you know, I was very lucky for her to choose me, as my as you know, as her mom. Yeah. And her story has helped many people to the point where I have had some instances where people have said that they have chosen to keep their child because of what happened with summer. So knowing that there are children out there that are alive because of my daughter, yeah. Is such a presence that I’ll never like, I’ll never forget that. That is just bring some purpose to Yeah, she’s helped a lot of people through the candles. They’ve had someone to come to, to me that they understood that I understood. So having someone that understands your situation to give you a bit of that roadmap, that helped me with my grief.
Bryan McCartney
Yeah. What about when we think about advice and things that people have said or encounters, you’ve had what’s been the worst piece of advice or the worst.
Yarni Dorge
That’s the worst piece of advice. But when I was dealing with the whole publicity of getting my name out there, and I need help,
Bryan McCartney
because some of the story like they’re losing the ashes that was on the news, it was on a couple of different programmes in the paper all over social media, all that sort of stuff. So it was pretty wildly widely promoted, or, you know, supported
Yarni Dorge
or two times that sort of thing. So there was a lot of vulnerability, I guess, putting myself out there. Because I was an army wife. There was expectations that I was supposed to be stoic, and that I wasn’t supposed to be being bad names to the military. And that was really hard for me to deal with because in my opinion, I’m a person, I’m not identity. I’m not, you know, my husband’s career choice does not define who I am all my choices, and I have just lost a child. And I’m trying to find my child. And she’s more than just ashes. She’s a missing person in my eyes. So it was difficult when I went to the police, and they shut me down. Yeah. One officer told me that’s disgusting. Why would someone want to steal your ashes? Another, you know, there was basically things said about my situation, why would you not put her in the car, a lot of very blatantly obvious things that we allow this to happen
Bryan McCartney
in your situation, have no idea but have great opinions Exactly.
Yarni Dorge
Well, they also have lost a child and I would never let my son’s ashes or my daughter’s ashes be in that situation. Whereas I was dealing with a three week old baby trying to have other people touch my things. And it was just chaos. There was people everywhere. So if someone did take that box, thinking that it was a desirable object, it was near the front door, I can’t control. We’re in a little townhouse complex, I can’t control who was walking past. I can’t control the desires of other human beings that have no idea what this is. I did tell all of the Packers, I had them standing with me. This is really important. This needs to go in my car. I don’t want this packed. So there were people that understood, so whether they took that I didn’t tell them what it was. But unless they took that as a wow, okay, this is obviously something important. Let’s have a look.
Bryan McCartney
It’s always pretty terrible as well, when people who’ve been in your situation, then come back and try and guilt you into feeling a certain way. Or if we’re Dick sometimes, especially.
Yarni Dorge
Yes, sitting behind, I had to block a couple of people, one lady in particular. What did she say it was something along the lines of I can’t believe you keep a dead carcass in your house. And just the insensitivity of other comments that were very similar. Why would you keep someone’s ashes? That’s gross. Other people were telling me Well, she didn’t want to obviously transfer with you to Brisbane. So she made this happen. I’m thinking, are you okay? And how could she choose?
Bryan McCartney
As as divine intervention?
Yarni Dorge
Just grow some legs out of the ashes and walk off?
Bryan McCartney
Sometimes people humanity is sometimes really disappointing, especially in those sorts of situations.
Yarni Dorge
Yeah. Especially when people think that they need to have an opinion.
Bryan McCartney
Hopefully, we’re talking about the minority of it was minority.
Yarni Dorge
Yeah. But they still exist. cool enough to the point where I had sleepless nights. Am I doing the right thing? I want to just shut this whole thing down. I can’t handle this. The negativity is next level. So but yeah, there was some horrible things. But there was also a lot of supportive things. And, again, I’m grateful for the people that have made the effort. organising things for me, when I was just numb, and had no idea on how to I was breathing. I was existing. I wasn’t, I wasn’t living. So interesting.
Bryan McCartney
We’re nearly at the end of our podcast episode today. But before we go, I know we talked before about advice that you would give to others. But I hopefully no one will ever have to experience what you have with losing some or twice. But for parents who are in that sort of situation of losing a baby, what is the number one thing that you think that would be most helpful for them,
Yarni Dorge
keep going. Absolutely keep going. Find those things that you can connect yourself with, to your child. They are your child, don’t stop talking about your child at the end of the day. If you have to sign their name on the Christmas card, if you want to get their name tattooed on you, or do a celebration, celebrate their birthday, every year, I have done that I have gathered people for her first birthday and we did a beautiful releasing into a little canal with some paper floating candles, all environmentally friendly. So if they did think of destroying fishes, but finding those things, I guess a lot of people shying away of balloon releases and things because of the environment that you know the issue that it causes. But doing something to remember sitting by a lake and light a candle. I loved the candle idea purely because it was something that I could do that gave me comfort that I felt like it was giving summer something but just don’t stop. As soon as you stop, chin down and you go down. Keep that chin up and just keep keep on keeping it’s you learn to walk again. You’ll have a limp for the rest of your life. But you’re walking and there are a lot of people They’re glad that you still are. So definitely reach out to those that you know will give you support. And eventually the support will stop. People will stop checking in. Because for everyone else life goes on for you that is your life. Yeah. So finding those finding those people that will be there for you when you just need a chat, or a psychologist or some, you know, medical intervention,
Bryan McCartney
professional help is always a good option. We’ve got some great organisations here in Brisbane that look after people specifically who have lost children precious wings is one of them. So I’m gonna pop a link to precious wings in our episode notes today for anyone that might need that. You only it’s been awesome talking to you. Thanks for joining us today. Always bye. You’ve been listening to Ushering Death. Don’t forget to like and subscribe. Follow us on your favourite podcast app and visit us at usheringdeath.com.au